揭秘CGTN主播劉欣的英語(yǔ)學(xué)習(xí)之路!原來(lái)英語(yǔ)是這樣“煉”成的!

5月30日，CGTN主播劉欣與美國(guó)?？怂股虡I(yè)頻道主播翠西·里根在萬(wàn)眾矚目下進(jìn)行了一場(chǎng)“辯論戰(zhàn)”。

劉欣的母校南京大學(xué)外國(guó)語(yǔ)學(xué)院，師生們積極為她加油打氣，學(xué)校官方微博、微信等社交平臺(tái)上專門做了“加油文”。

劉欣一時(shí)間成為萬(wàn)眾矚目的偶像，作為一名中國(guó)人，我們深感自豪!

對(duì)話中，劉欣自信、沉著、冷靜、不卑不亢，她敏捷的思維、機(jī)智的辯解以及流利純正的口語(yǔ)讓人不禁豎起大拇指。有不少同學(xué)喊話“要成為像劉欣一樣強(qiáng)的人!”

今天小編就來(lái)帶大家一起來(lái)了解下劉欣的求學(xué)之路~

2017年南京大學(xué)外國(guó)語(yǔ)學(xué)院百年院慶時(shí)，劉欣作為校友代表上臺(tái)發(fā)言。她對(duì)大學(xué)生活充滿懷念，對(duì)良師益友滿是感恩。

大學(xué)時(shí)，劉欣積極參加各種課外活動(dòng)，特別喜歡排演喜劇、唱英文歌，以及和外國(guó)的同學(xué)老師交流。

“學(xué)英語(yǔ)，‘用’是真諦?！?/strong>課堂上的劉欣總是分外積極地回答問(wèn)題，甚至有時(shí)還會(huì)拿著問(wèn)題追問(wèn)老師，用她的話來(lái)說(shuō)，就是“踴躍地參與學(xué)習(xí)的整個(gè)過(guò)程”。她認(rèn)為，學(xué)英語(yǔ)不能只靠死記硬背，而是靠“用”、靠“玩”、靠各種交流來(lái)掌握的。

如今，很多學(xué)生都有這個(gè)疑問(wèn)：怎么學(xué)習(xí)外語(yǔ)才會(huì)提高得更快?“一定要開(kāi)口說(shuō)，不管自己口音有多糟糕，只有越說(shuō)越多才會(huì)越來(lái)越好?！蹦暇┐髮W(xué)外國(guó)語(yǔ)學(xué)院一名大三學(xué)生這樣說(shuō)道。

劉欣曾說(shuō)，自己在大學(xué)期間并不是一個(gè)非常出色、用功的學(xué)生，四年內(nèi)留在教學(xué)樓晚自習(xí)的時(shí)間屈指可數(shù)。但她踴躍參加各種活動(dòng)，排練戲劇、唱英文歌等，她認(rèn)為興趣是最好的老師。

劉欣回憶自己上課回答問(wèn)題最積極，笑言自己總是在老師將要結(jié)束話題的時(shí)候進(jìn)行補(bǔ)充。正是由于這樣的積極，劉欣當(dāng)年才在報(bào)名演講比賽時(shí)第一個(gè)勇敢地舉手“我要去”，如今在記者發(fā)布會(huì)上也刨根問(wèn)底“我還有一個(gè)問(wèn)題”!

在南大外國(guó)語(yǔ)學(xué)院，幾乎每個(gè)學(xué)生都看過(guò)一段視頻——那是23年前劉欣參加英語(yǔ)演講的珍貴資料。

“劉欣學(xué)姐在23年前就已經(jīng)是個(gè)王者?！辈簧賹W(xué)生激動(dòng)地留言。

1995年，劉欣代表南京大學(xué)參加了首屆“21世紀(jì)杯”全國(guó)大學(xué)生英語(yǔ)演講比賽并獲得冠軍，首次捧起“21世紀(jì)杯”。

回顧獲獎(jiǎng)經(jīng)歷，劉欣表示，其實(shí)這很大程度上要?dú)w結(jié)于時(shí)機(jī)，“也許我的口才、文采、內(nèi)容都不是最優(yōu)秀的，但是那樣的時(shí)機(jī)讓我最后獲得了成功?！?996年，她又和其他三位同學(xué)代表中國(guó)參加在倫敦舉辦的世界英語(yǔ)演講賽，一舉奪得了全場(chǎng)總冠軍。

“當(dāng)時(shí)的演講主題是Mirror and I，我一上場(chǎng)看到臺(tái)上正好有個(gè)鏡子，于是第一句就現(xiàn)場(chǎng)發(fā)揮了一下?！鄙泶└鶕?jù)主題特意定制的旗袍，劉欣一上場(chǎng)就用機(jī)智打動(dòng)了評(píng)委。即使隔了20年時(shí)間，劉欣回想起宣布冠軍的那一刻，還是難掩激動(dòng)。

參加“21世紀(jì)杯”全國(guó)英語(yǔ)演講比賽對(duì)于劉欣而言，可謂是她生命的新起點(diǎn)。經(jīng)過(guò)這次大賽，劉欣不僅贏得了觀眾的掌聲、評(píng)委的認(rèn)可，也從此與電視結(jié)下了不解之緣。時(shí)任中央電視臺(tái)臺(tái)長(zhǎng)楊偉光先生邀請(qǐng)她加盟央視參與英語(yǔ)頻道的創(chuàng)建工作。從此，劉欣純正的英語(yǔ)、端莊的氣質(zhì)和獨(dú)特的個(gè)人魅力開(kāi)始被大眾所了解。

隨后的20年里，劉欣一次又一次從舒適區(qū)走出，從零開(kāi)始，挑戰(zhàn)自己。從新聞主播到做駐外記者，從駐外記者到評(píng)論節(jié)目主持人，選擇“折騰自己”，劉欣有著自己的執(zhí)著，“我知道只要我嘗試，就有成功的可能?！?/p>

作為我國(guó)英語(yǔ)教育界的一個(gè)傳統(tǒng)項(xiàng)目，“21世紀(jì)杯”全國(guó)英語(yǔ)演講比賽自1996年創(chuàng)辦以來(lái)，得到了全國(guó)師生和英語(yǔ)教育界專家的積極參與，一直被指定為每年在英國(guó)倫敦舉辦的國(guó)際英語(yǔ)演講比賽的中國(guó)區(qū)唯一選拔賽，面向全國(guó)在校大中小學(xué)生開(kāi)展。

來(lái)看看劉欣精彩的辯論~

劉欣VS翠西電視辯論中英雙語(yǔ)全文：

Trish Regan:Tonight, I have a special guest joining me all the way from Beijing, China to discuss the challenges of trade between the US and her home country.

She's the host of a primetime English language television programme overseen by the CCP, the Chinese Communist Party. And though she and I may not agree on everything, I believe this is actually a really unique opportunity, an opportunity to hear a very different view.

As these trade negotiations stall out, it's helpful to know how the Chinese communist party is thinking about trade and about the United States. In the interests of transparency, I should explain that I don't speak for anyone but myself as the host of a Fox Business show. My guest however is part of the CCP and that's fine. As I said, I welcome different perspectives on this show.

I'm very pleased tonight to welcome Ms. Liu Xin, host of the primetime opinion programme The Point with Liu Xin, to Trish Regan Primetime, tonight. To the viewers, please bear with us, as we have a significant time delay in our satellites between Beijing and the US and because of that we're going to do our very best not to speak over each other but Xin, welcome, it's good to have you here.

>>>快來(lái)測(cè)測(cè)你的口語(yǔ)啥水平？（免費(fèi)托?？谡Z(yǔ)測(cè)試）

翠西·里根：今天晚上我有一位特別的嘉賓，她是來(lái)自于中國(guó)北京，跟我們聊一聊美國(guó)和她的國(guó)家中國(guó)之間的貿(mào)易挑戰(zhàn)。

她是中國(guó)一檔黃金時(shí)段英語(yǔ)電視節(jié)目的主持人，該節(jié)目由中國(guó)共產(chǎn)黨監(jiān)督。我知道我們不可能在所有問(wèn)題上持相同意見(jiàn)，但我認(rèn)為這是一個(gè)非常好的機(jī)會(huì)，讓我們能夠聽(tīng)到非常不一樣的聲音。

目前貿(mào)易談判陷入僵局，所以能夠有機(jī)會(huì)了解中國(guó)共產(chǎn)黨對(duì)貿(mào)易的看法和對(duì)美國(guó)的看法，將是非常有意義的。為了透明起見(jiàn)，我要解釋一下，我不代表任何人，我只代表我自己，我的身份是?？怂闺娨暸_(tái)的節(jié)目主持人。我們這期節(jié)目的嘉賓則是中國(guó)共產(chǎn)黨的一員，但是沒(méi)關(guān)系。如我之前所說(shuō)，我歡迎不同的觀點(diǎn)、不同的視角。

那我們歡迎劉欣，她是黃金時(shí)段節(jié)目主持人，《欣視點(diǎn)》節(jié)目的主持人來(lái)到《翠西·里根黃金檔》節(jié)目。由于中國(guó)和美國(guó)衛(wèi)星信號(hào)連接有一些延遲，所以希望我們不會(huì)出現(xiàn)聲音重疊或把對(duì)方的聲音蓋住。劉欣，歡迎你，非常高興你來(lái)到我的節(jié)目。

Liu Xin:Thank you Trish, thank you for having me, it’s a great opportunity for me, unprecedented, I never dreamed that I would have this kind of opportunity to speak to you and to speak to many audiences in ordinary households in the United States.

I have to get it straight, I am not a member of the Communist Party of China (CPC), this is on the record. So please don’t assume that I’m a member, and I don’t speak for the Communist Party of China, here today I'm only speaking for myself, as Liu Xin, a journalist working for CGTN.

劉欣：謝謝你，翠西，非常感謝邀請(qǐng)我來(lái)到你的節(jié)目。今天是一個(gè)前所未有的機(jī)會(huì)，我之前從未想過(guò)能有這樣的機(jī)會(huì)跟你直接進(jìn)行溝通，跟美國(guó)的廣大觀眾進(jìn)行交流。

我必須說(shuō)明一下，我還不是中國(guó)共產(chǎn)黨黨員，這點(diǎn)是有檔案可查的，請(qǐng)不要先入為主地認(rèn)為我是一個(gè)黨員。我不代表中國(guó)共產(chǎn)黨的立場(chǎng)，我只代表我個(gè)人，劉欣，是CGTN的主播。

Trish Regan:What is your current assessment of where the trade talks actually are? Do you believe a deal is possible?

翠西·里根：你覺(jué)得中美貿(mào)易談判現(xiàn)在處在一個(gè)什么階段?你是否相信我們會(huì)達(dá)成一個(gè)協(xié)議?

Liu Xin:?I don’t have any insider information. What I know is the talks were not very successful last time, they were going on in the United States and now I think both sides are considering where to go next.

But I think the Chinese government has made its position very clear, that unless the United States treat the Chinese government, treat the Chinese negotiating team with respect and show the willingness to talk without using outside pressure, there is high possibility that there could be a productive trade deal. Otherwise we might be facing a prolonged period of problems for both sides.

劉欣：我沒(méi)有什么內(nèi)幕消息，只知道上一輪談判不是很順利，當(dāng)時(shí)是在美國(guó)談的?，F(xiàn)在雙方都在考慮未來(lái)前進(jìn)的方向。

中國(guó)政府已經(jīng)把立場(chǎng)說(shuō)得很清楚了，只要美方用公正的態(tài)度對(duì)待中國(guó)政府和中方的談判團(tuán)隊(duì)，拿出談判的誠(chéng)意，不施加外部壓力，還是很有希望達(dá)成一個(gè)好的結(jié)果的;否則雙方都會(huì)面臨一個(gè)長(zhǎng)期的僵局。

Trish Regan:I would stress that trade wars are never good. They're not good for anyone. So I want to believe that something can get done (LX: Agreed). These are certainly challenging times, I realise there's a lot of rhetoric out there. But let me turn to one of the biggest issues and that's intellectual property rights. Fundamentally, I think we can all agree it's never right to take something that's not yours. And yet in going through so many of these cases, cases that the independent World Trade Organisation, the WTO, that China is a member of, as well as the DOJ and FBI cases – you can actually see some of them on the screen right now – there's evidence there that China has stolen enormous amounts of intellectual property. Hundreds of billions of dollars’ worth. That's a lot of money.

But I guess we shouldn't really care if it's hundreds of billions of dollars or just 50 cents. How do American businesses operate in China if they're at risk for having their property, their ideas, their hard work stolen?

翠西·里根：我想強(qiáng)調(diào)的是，貿(mào)易戰(zhàn)從來(lái)都不是好事，對(duì)誰(shuí)都沒(méi)有任何好處。所以我愿意相信我們是會(huì)達(dá)成一些成果的(劉欣：同意)。這無(wú)疑是一個(gè)充滿挑戰(zhàn)的時(shí)代，我也看到有很多的言論。那讓我來(lái)提問(wèn)一個(gè)其中最主要的問(wèn)題，就是知識(shí)產(chǎn)權(quán)問(wèn)題。從根本上說(shuō)，我們都認(rèn)為，如果不是你的東西，你拿走是不對(duì)的。但是我們看到有很多這樣的案例，比如像WTO這樣獨(dú)立的國(guó)際組織，中國(guó)也是WTO的成員，還有美國(guó)司法部和聯(lián)邦調(diào)查局，都公布過(guò)此類案例，你現(xiàn)在可以從我們屏幕上面看到列出了其中一些這樣的案例。這些都是證據(jù)，顯示中國(guó)竊取了美國(guó)大量的知識(shí)產(chǎn)權(quán)，價(jià)值數(shù)千億美元。數(shù)額巨大。

但我們應(yīng)該真正關(guān)心的不是上億還是說(shuō)幾毛錢，而是：如果在中國(guó)做生意的美國(guó)企業(yè)面臨著它們的知識(shí)產(chǎn)權(quán)、創(chuàng)意、辛勤勞動(dòng)的成果被竊取的風(fēng)險(xiǎn)，它們還如何在中國(guó)做生意?

Liu Xin:You have to ask American businesses whether they wanted to come to China, whether they find coming to China and cooperating with Chinese businesses (has not been) profitable or not, and they will tell you their answers. As far as I understand many American companies have been established in China, they’re very profitable and the great majority of them I believe plan to continue to invest in China and explore the Chinese market. U.S. President Donald Trump’s tariff makes it a little bit more difficult, makes the future a little uncertain.

I do not deny that there are IP infringements, there are copyright issues or there are piracy or even theft of commercial secrets. I think that is something that has to be dealt with, and I think the Chinese government, the Chinese people and me as an individual, I think there’s a consensus because without the protection of IP rights, nobody, no country, no individual can be stronger, can develop itself. I think that is a very clear consensus among Chinese society.

And of course there are cases where individuals, where companies go and steal, and I think that’s a common practice probably in every part of the world, and there are companies in the United States who sue each other all the time over infringement on IP rights. You can’t say, simply because these cases are happening, that America is stealing, or China is stealing, or the Chinese people are stealing. And basically that’s the reason why I wrote that rebuttal, because that kind of blanket statement is really not helpful, really not helpful.

劉欣：你得問(wèn)美國(guó)的企業(yè)了，它們想不想來(lái)中國(guó)，它們?cè)谥袊?guó)做生意、與中國(guó)企業(yè)合作是否有利可圖，美國(guó)企業(yè)會(huì)告訴你他們的答案。據(jù)我所知，大部分在中國(guó)做生意的美國(guó)企業(yè)的利潤(rùn)都是非常豐厚的，絕大部分決定繼續(xù)在中國(guó)投資，不斷開(kāi)拓中國(guó)市場(chǎng)。但是美國(guó)總統(tǒng)特朗普的關(guān)稅政策使這種計(jì)劃變得困難，也讓未來(lái)變得更加不確定。

我不否認(rèn)有侵犯知識(shí)產(chǎn)權(quán)的情況，有版權(quán)問(wèn)題、盜版問(wèn)題甚至商業(yè)機(jī)密被竊取的問(wèn)題。我認(rèn)為這是必須要處理的問(wèn)題，而中國(guó)政府、中國(guó)人民，包括我自己作為一個(gè)個(gè)體，都有一個(gè)共識(shí)，就是：沒(méi)有知識(shí)產(chǎn)權(quán)的保護(hù)，任何一個(gè)國(guó)家、任何一個(gè)人，都無(wú)法發(fā)展壯大。所以說(shuō)這個(gè)是我們?nèi)鐣?huì)的一個(gè)共識(shí)。

當(dāng)然，是有一些個(gè)人或者公司去竊取的情況，這個(gè)我覺(jué)得也不僅僅在中國(guó)，在全世界都很普遍，美國(guó)公司也有這樣的情況，因?yàn)橹R(shí)產(chǎn)權(quán)侵權(quán)而打官司。你不能僅僅因?yàn)檫@些案例就說(shuō)美國(guó)在盜竊，或者中國(guó)、中國(guó)人民在盜竊。這也是我為什么之前做出那樣的回應(yīng)，因?yàn)檫@樣籠統(tǒng)的指責(zé)無(wú)益于問(wèn)題的解決。

Trish Regan:It's not just a statement, it's multiple reports, including evidence from the WTO. But let me ask you about Huawei because that's certainly in the headlines now…

I think we can all agree that if you're going to do business with someone, it has to be based on trust. You don't want anyone stealing your valuable information that you've spent decades working on. Anyway, China passed a law in 2017 requiring tech companies to work with the military and the government, so it's not just individual companies that might be getting access to this technology, it's the government itself, which is an interesting nuance. But I get that China is upset that Huawei is not being welcomed into the US markets, I totally get it, so let me just ask you this. It’s an interesting way to think about it. What if we said, 'hey sure, Huawei, come on in, but here's the deal, you must share all those incredible technological advances that you've been working on, you've got to share it with us', would that be ok?

翠西·里根：這不是我的說(shuō)辭，而是有很多相關(guān)報(bào)告的，包括WTO也有這樣的證據(jù)。我們現(xiàn)在來(lái)談?wù)勅A為的問(wèn)題，這是一個(gè)熱點(diǎn)話題。

我們其實(shí)都會(huì)同意，如果我們想跟別人做生意，必須基于互信。你不希望在做生意的時(shí)候，別人把你研究了幾十年的很有價(jià)值的東西偷走。中國(guó)從2017年開(kāi)始授權(quán)科技企業(yè)與軍方和政府合作(譯注：翠西此處應(yīng)該是指中央軍民融合發(fā)展委員會(huì)成立于2017年1月22日)，這就意味著不僅只是一個(gè)公司行為，而是政府行為了，這兩者之間是有稍許區(qū)別的。但據(jù)我所知，華為不能進(jìn)入美國(guó)市場(chǎng)，中國(guó)覺(jué)得不太高興，這我也可以理解。但我換種方式來(lái)問(wèn)吧，這么問(wèn)或許更有趣，比如 “華為，來(lái)我們美國(guó)市場(chǎng)吧。但我們先約法三章：你必須跟我們分享你們所取得的那些巨大的科技成就”，這種方式，你覺(jué)得可以嗎?

Liu Xin:I think if it is through cooperation, if it is through mutual learning, if you pay for the use of this IP or high technology, it’s absolutely fine, why not? We all prosper because we learn from each other, I learnt English because I had American teachers, I learnt English because I had American friends, I still learn how to do journalism because I have American copy editors or editors. I think that’s fine so long as it’s not illegal, I think everybody should do that and that’s how you get better.

劉欣：如果通過(guò)合作的框架，互相學(xué)習(xí)，如果你支付了知識(shí)產(chǎn)權(quán)的費(fèi)用，我覺(jué)得是可以的。為什么不呢?我們互相學(xué)習(xí)才能共同進(jìn)步。我自己也學(xué)英語(yǔ)，因?yàn)槲矣忻绹?guó)老師，我有美國(guó)的朋友，同時(shí)我做新聞，我的編輯、同事很多都是美國(guó)人。只要不是違法的事情，都是可以做的，大家都應(yīng)該這么做，才能夠不斷讓自己做得更好。

Trish Regan:You mentioned something pretty important, which is that you should pay for the acquisition of that (IP). I think that the liberalized economic world in which we live has valued intellectual property and it's governed by a set of laws. So we all need to play by the rules and play by those laws if we're going to have that kind of trust between each other. But I think you bring up some good points. Let me turn to China right now which is, wow, the second largest economy. At what point will China decide to abandon its developing nation status and stop borrowing from the World Bank?

翠西·里根：你說(shuō)的有一點(diǎn)非常重要，就是你要獲得這些(知識(shí)產(chǎn)權(quán))，你就得付費(fèi)。我覺(jué)得我們生活在一個(gè)經(jīng)濟(jì)自由化的世界，我們歷來(lái)都很重視知識(shí)產(chǎn)權(quán)的保護(hù)，并且知識(shí)產(chǎn)權(quán)是受到一整套法律保護(hù)的。如果我們想要達(dá)成對(duì)彼此的互信的話，我們都需要根據(jù)規(guī)則和法律行事。我現(xiàn)在換個(gè)話題吧，中國(guó)已經(jīng)是世界第二大經(jīng)濟(jì)體，你覺(jué)得什么時(shí)候中國(guó)會(huì)停止稱自己為發(fā)展中國(guó)家，會(huì)不再向世界銀行借錢?

Liu Xin:Well I think this kind of discussion is going on, and I’ve heard very live discussions about this. And indeed there are people talking about China becoming so big, why don’t you just grow up? Basically I think you said it in your program as well, “China, grow up!” I think we want to grow up, we don’t want to be dwarfed or poor, underdeveloped all the time. But it depends on how you define developing country. If you look at China’s overall size, the overall size of the Chinese economy, yes, we are very big. But don’t forget we have 1.4 billion people, that is over three times the population of the United States. So if you divide the second largest overall economy in the world, basically when it comes down to per capita GDP we are less than one sixth of that of the United States, and even less than some other more developed countries in Europe.

So you tell me where we should put ourselves. This is a very complicated issue, because per capita as I said is very small, but overall it’s very big. So we can do a lot of big things, and people are looking upon us to do much more around the world. I think we are doing that, we are contributing to the United Nations. We are the world's biggest contributor to the UN peacekeeping missions (among the five permanent members of the UN), we are giving out donations and humanitarian aid and all of that because we know we have to grow up. And Trish, thank you for that reminder.

劉欣：我覺(jué)得這種討論，也在進(jìn)行之中，我聽(tīng)到了很多現(xiàn)場(chǎng)的討論，的確，有人說(shuō)中國(guó)已經(jīng)成為一個(gè)大國(guó)，為什么不能像一個(gè)成人一樣長(zhǎng)大?；旧夏阋苍谀愕墓?jié)目中，也說(shuō)到，說(shuō)中國(guó)要長(zhǎng)大，我們的確也想要變的強(qiáng)大，我們不想要一直是一個(gè)弱小、貧窮、欠發(fā)達(dá)的國(guó)家，但這也要取決于你如何定義發(fā)展中國(guó)家，對(duì)嗎?如果你看中國(guó)整體的經(jīng)濟(jì)體量，的確是體量非常大，但是你不要忘了，我們有14億人口，這個(gè)是美國(guó)的三倍之多。雖然中國(guó)是世界第二大經(jīng)濟(jì)體，但是如果按人均GDP來(lái)算的話，大概是美國(guó)人均GDP的六分之一。與某些歐洲發(fā)達(dá)國(guó)家相比，甚至?xí)佟?/p>

那你告訴我，我們?cè)撊绾味ㄎ蛔约耗?這是一個(gè)非常復(fù)雜的問(wèn)題，因?yàn)橄裎宜f(shuō)的人均的數(shù)值很小的，但是總體的體量又很大，我們可以做一些大事，人們也寄希望于中國(guó)，在全球有更多的貢獻(xiàn)。我們的確也在這么做，我們?yōu)槁?lián)合國(guó)做出了很多的貢獻(xiàn)，我們是聯(lián)合國(guó)(五個(gè)常任理事國(guó)中)維和行動(dòng)最大的貢獻(xiàn)方，我們給了捐贈(zèng)、給了人道主義援助等等。我知道我們要繼續(xù)壯大。翠西感謝你，你提醒的這一點(diǎn)非常好。

Trish Regan:Let's get to the tariffs. I've seen some of your commentaries too. And Xin, I appreciate that you think China could lower some of its tariffs. I watched you say that and I'm totally in agreement with you. In 2016, the average tariff, effectively a tax, that was charged on an American good in China was 9.9%. That was nearly three times what the US was charging. So what do you say about this, what do you think about saying "hey, to heck with these tariffs, let's get rid of them altogether." Would that work?

翠西·里根：那我們來(lái)談?wù)勱P(guān)稅的問(wèn)題，我也看了你之前的一些評(píng)論。劉欣，我也很感謝，你說(shuō)中國(guó)可以降低一些關(guān)稅，我看到你說(shuō)了這個(gè)話，我完全同意你這個(gè)觀點(diǎn)，2016年加征在美國(guó)產(chǎn)品上的平均關(guān)稅，是9.9%，比美國(guó)加征在中國(guó)身上的高三倍。你覺(jué)得這個(gè)關(guān)稅該怎么解決?如果我建議說(shuō)“要不咱們采取統(tǒng)一行動(dòng)，統(tǒng)一降低關(guān)稅”，你覺(jué)得這可行嗎?

Liu Xin:I think that would be a wonderful idea. Don’t you think for American consumers, products from China would be even cheaper? And for consumers in China, products from America would be so much cheaper too? I think that would be a wonderful idea, I think we should work towards that. But you talked about rule-based system, rule-based order. This is the thing, if you want to change the rules it has to be done in mutual consensus, basically when we talk about tariffs it’s not just between China and the United States. I understand if you lower tariffs just between China and the United States the Europeans will come, the Japanese will come, the Venezuelans will probably come and say 'hey, we want the same tariffs'. You can’t discriminate between countries. So it’s a very complicated settlement to reach. I think the last time the world agreed on the kind of tariff reduction China should commit to, was exactly the result of multilateral and years of difficult negotiations. The United States saw, in its interests, and decided to what degree they could agree, or to what degree they could lower their tariff - nobody put a gun to their head - and China agreed, although with some difficulty, to lower their, our, tariff considerably, it is all the decision of countries according to their own self-interest. Now things are different, yes, I agree, 20 years later, what are we going to do? Maybe these old rules need to be changed. You know what, let’s talk about it, let’s do it according to the rules, the same rules, but if you don’t like the rules, we'll change the rules, but it has to be a multilateral process.

劉欣：我覺(jué)得這是一個(gè)很好的想法。你不覺(jué)得這對(duì)于美國(guó)消費(fèi)者來(lái)說(shuō)，他們可以享受更加實(shí)惠的中國(guó)產(chǎn)品?對(duì)于中國(guó)的消費(fèi)者來(lái)說(shuō)美國(guó)的產(chǎn)品也會(huì)變的實(shí)惠?這是我們共同努力的方向。你提到一個(gè)基于規(guī)則的一個(gè)系統(tǒng)，或者是一個(gè)基于規(guī)則的秩序，所以說(shuō)，如果要改變規(guī)則的話，就必須雙方先達(dá)成共識(shí)。您談到關(guān)稅的問(wèn)題，不光是中美之間的問(wèn)題。如果你降低中美之間的關(guān)稅，那歐洲會(huì)來(lái)、日本也會(huì)來(lái)、委內(nèi)瑞拉也會(huì)來(lái)，同樣要求降低關(guān)稅，你不能區(qū)別對(duì)待，所以要達(dá)成這個(gè)協(xié)議，是非常復(fù)雜的。對(duì)，我是說(shuō)關(guān)于貿(mào)易的問(wèn)題，關(guān)于關(guān)稅的，我認(rèn)為上一次全球達(dá)成關(guān)于降低關(guān)稅的意見(jiàn)，中方也做出了承諾，這就是多邊主義和長(zhǎng)期艱難談判的結(jié)果。美國(guó)看到自己的利益，決定他們要降低到什么程度，降低多少，沒(méi)人拿搶指著他們的腦袋。中國(guó)雖然遇到了一些困難，那我們也大幅降低了我們的關(guān)稅，這都是各國(guó)基于自身利益做出的決定?，F(xiàn)在大環(huán)境變了，我同意，20年過(guò)去了，我們現(xiàn)在要怎么做，有一些規(guī)則是需要改變的。你知道嗎?那我們就聊聊這些規(guī)則，我們可以按照相同的規(guī)則行事，如果你不喜歡一些規(guī)則，那我們就改變它，但是我說(shuō)的是這必須是多方達(dá)成的共同決定。

Trish Regan:There are rules. You can go back to the trade agreement of 1974, section 301, there is a rule that enables the United States to use tariffs to try and influence the behavior of China, should it be taking, stealing our intellectual property. And that, I think in some ways, is part of what this all comes back to and it's a sense of trust. I hear you on the forced technology transfer and I think that some American companies perhaps have made some mistakes in terms of being willing to overlook what they might have to give up in the near term, but this an issue where the country as a whole needs to step in. And we're seeing the United States do that, perhaps in a way that hasn't happened. It's been in the background, don't get me wrong. I think previous administrations have identified the challenge but have really been a little unwilling to take it on so we're living in these very different times. How do you define state capitalism?

翠西·里根：那我們回到1974年《貿(mào)易法》301條款，《貿(mào)易法》301條款中，有規(guī)則授權(quán)美國(guó)可以用關(guān)稅去限制中國(guó)的行為，如果中國(guó)拿走或竊取知識(shí)產(chǎn)權(quán)的話。某種程度來(lái)說(shuō)，這是事情的本源，是關(guān)于信任的問(wèn)題。你談到強(qiáng)迫技術(shù)轉(zhuǎn)讓，一些美國(guó)公司也許做了錯(cuò)誤的決定，愿意按照中國(guó)的要求，放棄一些東西。這個(gè)問(wèn)題要從國(guó)家的角度介入。我們看到美國(guó)已經(jīng)做出一些舉措，并且是以一種前所未有的方式在做?，F(xiàn)在實(shí)情就是如此，請(qǐng)不要誤解為我的個(gè)人想法。我想說(shuō)之前的政府看到了這樣一些挑戰(zhàn)，但是他們沒(méi)有想要解決的意愿，目前來(lái)講時(shí)代變了。你怎么定義國(guó)家資本主義?

Liu Xin:You mean how do I define…? Sorry I didn’t hear the last bit, you mean the forced technology transfer, or so-called forced technology transfer?

劉欣：我沒(méi)有聽(tīng)清，您能再說(shuō)一遍嗎?想要定義什么?我聽(tīng)到你說(shuō)強(qiáng)迫技術(shù)轉(zhuǎn)讓。

Trish Regan:No, state capitalism. I talked about forced technology transfer, but state capitalism.

翠西·里根：不，國(guó)家資本主義。之前是談到過(guò)強(qiáng)迫技術(shù)轉(zhuǎn)讓，但現(xiàn)在說(shuō)的是國(guó)家資本主義。

Liu Xin:Because you started with the forced technology transfer and somehow you skit away.

劉欣：你之前談強(qiáng)迫技術(shù)轉(zhuǎn)讓，怎么突然跳到了別的主題?

Trish Regan:Hang on one second, Xin. Your system of economics is very interesting because you have a capitalist system but it's state-run, so talk to us about that, how do you define it?

翠西·里根：等一下劉欣，你讓我說(shuō)完，你們的經(jīng)濟(jì)體系，是挺有意思的，你們有一個(gè)資本主義的體系，但是受國(guó)家控制的。跟我們聊一聊這方面，你是如何定義的?

Liu Xin:We would like to define it as socialism with Chinese characteristics, where market forces are expected to play the dominating or the deciding role in the allocation of resources. Basically, we want it to be a market economy but there are some Chinese characteristics, for instance some state owned enterprises which are playing an important but increasingly smaller role, maybe, in the economy. And everybody thinks that China's economy is state-owned, everything is state-controlled, everything is state, state, state, but let me tell you, it is not the true picture. If you look at the statistics, for instance 80% of Chinese employees were employed by private enterprises, 80% of Chinese exports were done by private companies, 65% of technological innovation were achieved, carried out, by private enterprises, some of the largest companies that affect our lives, for instance some Internet companies or some 5G technology companies, they are private companies. So we are, yes, a socialist economy with Chinese characteristics, but not everything is state-controlled, state-run, it’s not like that, we are actually quite mixed, very dynamic and actually very very open as well.

劉欣：我們定義是中國(guó)特色社會(huì)主義市場(chǎng)經(jīng)濟(jì)，市場(chǎng)力量依然是占主導(dǎo)力量，它在資源分配上，起決定性作用。它本身是市場(chǎng)經(jīng)濟(jì)，但是會(huì)有中國(guó)特色。比如說(shuō)有一些國(guó)有企業(yè)，在經(jīng)濟(jì)中，起到非常重要的，但是相對(duì)越來(lái)越小的作用。大家都會(huì)覺(jué)得中國(guó)的經(jīng)濟(jì)，所有都是國(guó)家控制，所有都是國(guó)家、國(guó)家、國(guó)家，但事實(shí)卻并不是如此，你如果看一下數(shù)字，80%中國(guó)雇員都是受雇于民營(yíng)企業(yè)的，也有80%的出口來(lái)自于民營(yíng)企業(yè)。65%的創(chuàng)新是源于民營(yíng)企業(yè)。很多對(duì)人們?nèi)粘Ｉ钣绊懢薮蟮墓?，比如說(shuō)一些網(wǎng)絡(luò)公司、5G公司，都是私營(yíng)企業(yè)。我們的確是中國(guó)特色社會(huì)主義市場(chǎng)經(jīng)濟(jì)，但不是所有的東西都是由國(guó)家控制，我們其實(shí)是一個(gè)非?；旌?、非?；钴S、非常開(kāi)放的經(jīng)濟(jì)體。

Trish Regan:I think you need to probably keep being open. I think that that, as a free trade person myself, I think that that's the direction to pursue and ultimately that leads to greater economic prosperity for you and better economic prosperity for us, so then you get a win-win. This was interesting, I appreciate you being here. Thank you.

翠西·里根：我覺(jué)得你們可能希望能夠繼續(xù)這樣開(kāi)放，因?yàn)槲覀€(gè)人是自由貿(mào)易支持者，我認(rèn)為這是正確的方向。最終我們希望中國(guó)更繁榮，美國(guó)也更繁榮，這樣的話我們才能雙贏。我覺(jué)得我們的對(duì)話很有趣，非常感謝你。

Liu Xin:Thank you, thank you so much. If you want to have a discussion in the future, we can do that.

劉欣：謝謝，非常感謝!如果未來(lái)還想討論的話，我們也可以繼續(xù)。

Trish Regan:I'd love it.

翠西·里根：我是非常希望的。

Liu Xin:If you want to come to China, you're welcome and I'll take you around. Thank you Trish for the opportunity.

劉欣：愿意來(lái)中國(guó)的話，我們也非常歡迎，感謝!

Trish Regan:Thank you.

翠西·里根：非常感謝。

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